Trevor Scott

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Posts by Trevor Scott

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  343

  Defence of watchtower society Links

  by reniaa in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i thought long and hard before making this thread, that many will not agree with it but i think there needs to be balance and people to realise there are alternate viewpoints out there on many of these subjects, the ones that are most spoke about on this forum.

  i was recently sent a full message containing mary's book and these links give the rebuttal to many of her points.

  those that are still open-minded enough feel free to look over them even if in the end you still don't agree at least you have heard both the defence as well as the attack as they are on the internet.

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  Trevor Scott

  Reniaa,

  In light of Deut 18:20-22, I am still waiting for you to justify your WT leaders proclaiming their false prophecy as "the Creator's promise" and "Jehovah's prophetic word":

  "...the Creator’s promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away."

  "Jehovah's prophetic word through Jesus Christ is: 'This generation [of 1914] will by no means pass away until all things occur.' (Luke 21:32) And Jehovah, who is the source of inspired and unfailing prophecy, will bring about the fulfillment." --WT 5/15 1984 p6 (note, "[of 1914]" is in the original text)

  The leaders of this cult attributed their false prophecy directly to God; they said their false prophecy was HIS WORD and HIS PROMISE. Consider also that these statements were made in print and delivered to MILLIONS of people around the world. In other words, your cult leaders told millions of people around the world that God PROMISED something that he did not promise. And they did this repeatedly for many years.

  In case you don't have your nwt handy, here's Deut 18:20-22: "However, the prophet who presumes to speak in my name a word that I have not commanded him to speak or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die. And in case you should say in your heart: 'How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?' When the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak. With presumptuousness the prophet spoke it. You must not get frightened at him."

  I await your reply.

  TS
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  343

  Defence of watchtower society Links

  by reniaa in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i thought long and hard before making this thread, that many will not agree with it but i think there needs to be balance and people to realise there are alternate viewpoints out there on many of these subjects, the ones that are most spoke about on this forum.

  i was recently sent a full message containing mary's book and these links give the rebuttal to many of her points.

  those that are still open-minded enough feel free to look over them even if in the end you still don't agree at least you have heard both the defence as well as the attack as they are on the internet.

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  Trevor Scott

  Are Jw's wrong because they got a few dates wrong?

  LOL. Someone is in denial..

  Forget about the fact that they got MANY dates wrong (all the while professing to be God's channel of communication, mind you) and focus on the fact that they attributed their FALSE PROPHECY to God:

  "...the Creator’s promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away."

  Here's another:

  "Jehovah's prophetic word through Jesus Christ is: 'This generation [of 1914] will by no means pass away until all things occur.' (Luke 21:32) And Jehovah, who is the source of inspired and unfailing prophecy, will bring about the fulfillment." --WT 5/15 1984 p6 (note, "[of 1914]" is in the original text)

  Considering the fact that your cult leaders have since acknowledged their '1914 generation' doctrine to be FALSE, please tell me how "Jehovah" might feel about them attributing their lies to Him:

  "However, the prophet who presumes to speak in my name a word that I have not commanded him to speak or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die. And in case you should say in your heart: 'How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?' When the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak. With presumptuousness the prophet spoke it. You must not get frightened at him." (Deut. 18:20-22, NWT)

  TS
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  41

  Blood taking...is it a disfellowshipping offence or up to conscience.

  by Gill in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  can you tell me whether the taking of blood is a conscience matter or a disfellowshipping matter?.

  i ask this because i have just come away from a heated discussion with my parents and they insist that taking blood or blood products has always been a matter of conscience and no one has ever been disfellowshipped for taking blood.

  they say that a question was raised at the service meeting over the new blood card/documents whether taking blood fractions was breaking gods law and the presiding overseer j.h said that taking blood has always been a conscience matter and never was anyone disfellowshipped for it.. is this true?

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  Trevor Scott

  they insist that taking blood or blood products has always been a matter of conscience and no one has EVER been disfellowshipped for taking blood.

  Not true at all. The Society has softened their stance on blood in recent years and they would love nothing more than for the world at large to conveniently forget about their previous total ban on blood:

  Is it wrong to sustain life by infusions of blood or plasma or red cells or the various blood fractions? Yes! ... regardless of whether it is whole blood or a blood fraction, whether it is blood taken from one's own body or that taken from someone else, whether it is administrated as a transfusion or an injection, the divine law applies. --The Watchtower 09/15/1961 p. 557-559

  TS.
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  3

  The truth? I don't think so...

  by Trevor Scott in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hey there,.

  was doing a little research for a paper i am writing and came across this statement on the wt cd:*** w75 6/15 361 stability even though nations shake ***.

  in 1914 the time came for christ to accept invisible kingdom power over the world.

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  Trevor Scott

  And the fact that the average Witness doesn't have access to the older publications doesn't help either. Not that the average Witness would ever think of actually checking up on the Society's claims...

  Trevor.
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  3

  The truth? I don't think so...

  by Trevor Scott in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hey there,.

  was doing a little research for a paper i am writing and came across this statement on the wt cd:*** w75 6/15 361 stability even though nations shake ***.

  in 1914 the time came for christ to accept invisible kingdom power over the world.

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  Trevor Scott

  Hey there,

  Was doing a little research for a paper I am writing and came across this statement on the WT CD:

  *** w75 6/15 361 Stability even Though Nations Shake ***
  In 1914 the time came for Christ to accept invisible Kingdom power over the world. (Dan. 4:32) This fact was widely announced by Christians at that time.

  As some of you will no doubt immediately recognize, this statement is a bald-faced lie! In 1914, JWs were still 'announcing' that Christ had accepted invisible Kingdom power in 1878 - not 1914. As I recall, the WTS held this view until the 1930s.

  Check it out in some publications from the era:

  Since that time it has been emphatically manifest that the time had come in A.D. 1878 when kingly judgment should begin at the house of God. It is here that 'Rev. 14:14-20' applies, and our Lord is brought to view as the Reaper crowned. The year A.D. 1878, being the parallel of his assuming power and authority in the type, clearly marks the time for the actual assuming of power as King of kings, by our present, spiritual, invisible Lord--the time of his taking to himself his great power to reign, which in the prophecy is closely associated with the resurrection of his faithful, and the beginning of the trouble and wrath upon the nations. --The Time Is At Hand, 1907, page 239.

  Our Lord, the appointed King, is now present, since October 1874, AD, according to the testimony of the prophets, to those who have ears to hear it: and the formal inauguration of his kingly office dates from April 1878, AD: and the first work of the Kingdom, as shown by our Lord, in his parables and prophecy (the gathering of "his elect") is now in progress. --The Battle of Armageddon, 1913, page 621-622.

  The WTS all too frequently resorts to this tactic of outright lying to support their claim to being God's prophet and watchman on the 1914 scene.

  Regards,

  TS.
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  6

  need information about UN

  by faithful in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  just joined forum - curious about a posting i read about the un.

  what are you talking about witnesses being part of the un?

  can anyone help me?

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  Trevor Scott

  Some years ago the WT aligned themselves with the UN as a non-governmental organization. This was done in the same manner as the other religions of the world. In forming this relationship, the WTS agreed to support the UN and encourage others to do so. The Society went so far as to publish pro-UN information in their magazines (part of the requirement for joining). Much information on the Society's relationship with the UN has been compiled and is available here: http://www.randytv.com/secret/unitednations.htm

  Regards,

  Trevor.
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  33

  Depressed and doubting...

  by dura-luxe in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've been out for 8 years, and for the first time in my life i am doubting.. not big doubts, but little ones.

  it's all the middle east and the "peace and security" talk.

  i feel like armageddon is coming.. the brainwashing never ends.

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  Trevor Scott

  One thing I would like to add, sort of a pet peeve of mine :)

  "Peace and Security" per 1 Thess comes from the BIBLE, not the JWs. Those of us who have come out of the WTS have difficulty making the differentiation sometimes, but when you stop and think about it, why should talk of peace and security send anyone to the JWs? They didn't write the verse. If anything it should perhaps make one consider scripture or maybe Christian religion in general. No need to run to a petty little religion that latches onto every doomsday verse they can find...

  Just my two cents,

  Later,

  PS - For what it is worth, I have been out for 4 years or so; studied the WTS and Christianity *extensively*. In the past four years of my life I have doubted every aspect of my existence EXCEPT the validity of the Watchtower Society. They are a fraud, plain and simple.
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  19

  DIM goes out in service

  by DIM in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  well, i'm moving away across the country in 2 months and my mother wants to spend some time with me.

  being a pioneer, her idea of spending time with her oldest son is working out in service for a morning....i've decided to go along with her tomorrow morning because i really couldn't think of a good excuse, since i'm presently laid off from my job and collecting $$ from the state of pa. i haven't been out since about march and am not looking forward to this at all.

  hopefully i won't have to talk or say much.

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  Trevor Scott

  Skeptic said:
  

  If you don't want to say anything to a householder, "We're Jehovah's Witnesses and we have come with the latest magazines."
  A guaranteed conversation stopper. A sister in our cong used it for years with a 0% success rate.

  Lol. I used this one for ten years myself. The secret is a looooong pause after that killer introduction!

  TS,

  Did the Watchtower Society "support" the scarlet beast of Revelation?
  : http://www.geocities.com/watchtowersociety/beast.htm
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  5

  Interesting quote in light of the UN thing

  by Trevor Scott in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i came across this quote in a 1981 wt article today.

  thought i would post it in light of the un thing:.

  *** w81 9/15 23 disfellowshiping-how to view it ***.

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  Trevor Scott

  I came across this quote in a 1981 WT article today. Thought I would post it in light of the UN thing:

  *** w81 9/15 23 Disfellowshiping-How to View It ***
  15 Or, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of an organization whose objective is contrary to the Bible, and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Compare Revelation 19:17-21; Isaiah 2:4.) So if one who was a Christian chose to join those who are disapproved of God, it would be fitting for the congregation to acknowledge by a brief announcement that he had disassociated himself and is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses.

  I'm pretty sure the scarlet-colored wild beast can safely be considered "disapproved of God."

  JosephAlward might get a kick out of this quote...

  (Apologies if someone already posted this, btw.)

  TS,

  Did the Watchtower Society "support" the scarlet beast of Revelation?
  : http://www.geocities.com/watchtowersociety/beast.htm
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  39

  WTS Document found in UN Collection - MAJOR

  by hawkaw in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i have received a package from the united nations high commissioner for human rights.

  you may recall that dino found out that the uns high commissioners office in geneva, switzerland has in its collection the november 22, 1998 awake!

  magazine article titled a long job finished (pages 3 and 4) and a second article titled the universal declaration of human rights (page 5).

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  Trevor Scott

  Hawk,

  Great job, and thanks for posting.

  WTS claims of ignorance are looking weaker and weaker.

  TS,

  Did the Watchtower Society "support" the scarlet beast of Revelation?
  : http://www.geocities.com/watchtowersociety/beast.htm